Originally posted by BorisG The only serios problem that Brazil is facing is the non-brazilians whining about problems in Brazil. If gringoes are not accostomed to carrying around toilet paper or foregoing the use thereof, then the best they can do is to go where they can have unobstructed access to this non-essential hygiene item (by Brazilian standards). When in Brazil do as Brazilians.... Hold it or discreetly borrow some napkins from the table.

This video makes me laugh, and it seems appropriate here:

First World Problems

Originally posted by hpeak13 Originally posted by irishlass I have been running a business in the Amazon for the past 8 years and coming over 3-4 times a year for a month at a time. A year ago I decided to make the move here permanently to expand my business, and have had the most hideous 12 months of my life.I speak fluent portuguese, know the region I moved to,am flexible and tolerant about the endless Brazilian bureacracy and have tried to integrate into the community. Despite the fact that I invest heavily in the local economy, in social projects and provide employment, I have felt like an alien on a different planet. I felt as though I have been thrown into a pit of vultures, every single person I know here bar none has tried to fleece me in some way or another. It seems that us gringoes are considered the first target for any sob story, scam or dishonesty.( and I am married to a local- his family are amongst the worst offenders This is just a warning to anyone thinking of making the move, think long and hard about it. The cultural differences are vast, and unless you lock yourself away in a cocooned mainly ex-pat society ( there are none where I live)you will find it an uphill struggle. I am relieved to be leaving, but saddened that fundamentally, in my experience, we are not welcome. for newbies reading this post:  These are not the feelings of ALL gringos who move here. Some love it here, feel that they fit in quite fine, and enjoy their new lives

not all gringos come from the same country (if we are using the gringo definition in Brazil of course... in the rest of latin america, gringos are all americans)

not all gringos live in the same places of Brazil

not all gringos had the same life experiences

they are not the same person.


to each his own. Its quite normal people will have different experiences, some good, some bad.

not all immigrants to the US love it there too.


a valid topic, still, its only a personal experience.

Originally posted by incliner As an European, I believe that Brazil is getting in average very good immigration (I will not count Italian terrorists, crem de la crem of worldwide thiefs etc), opposite to one we are getting here... Meaning, 100% of immigration I met in Brazil are well educated, usually recognized professionals in their fields, with high employment potential

thats quite the nonsense. Thats because all immigrants you came in contact with are other europeans or americans. Obviously, poor europeans or americans wouldnt immigrate to a 3d world country.


but these people you met are a small fraction of immigration to Brazil. By far, most immigrants to Brazil come from other latin american countries (specially bolivians), there are also plenty of africans and many chinese.

Take a tour at 25 de Março in São Paulo, and you will meet more poor chinese immigrants in one street than the whole collective of european/american immigrants in the whole Brazil.

now, I cant affirm that, but I suppose most of the expat community you guys came in contact with while in Brazil is a small universe of english speakers in Brazil, maybe with the addition of some northern europeans.

portuguese and spaniard expats, maybe italians as well, are probably a fraction of the people that you guys get to know in expat meetings, while in truth there are many more of them than english speakers (americans, canadians, brits, autralians) plus nord europeans.

from Wikipedia
"Mais recentemente, a partir da década de 1970, vê-se um razoável crescimento na entrada de imigrantes no Brasil, vindos principalmente da Coréia do Sul, China, Bolívia, Peru, Paraguai e de países africanos"

there is an estimate 600 thousand illegal immigrants in Brazil. Most, are from the countries listed above (S.Korea, China, Bolivia, Peru, Paraguay and several african countries)

According to some sources, there are over 200 thousand bolivians in São Paulo alone (illegals).

When it comes to people who are just crossing the border, we sometimes do not count them as immigration... As my grandfather uses to say, if you can reach a place on a donkey, you didn't travel..

Of course that hundreds of thousands especially illegal immigrants can't do any good, question is what is their impact on the country?

There is an example of England, where you have Polish/Romanian/etc. invasion... Not necessarily all Polish people going there are average or below educated, quite contrary, but the point is they come to London (extremely expensive), 20 of them rent a house and than, sharing expenses, they can accept to work for money that is few times lesser than the one average Joe would work for... Which leaves Joe in a very bad position when it comes to his basic needs, mortgage, car lease, kids education... That is the type of devastating immigration.

What I had in mind posting the first post is: if people I met get the chance to pass 15% of the knowledge they have to young Brazilian managers, lawyers, students etc, than Brazil is going to profit in the most important field: brain import.

Because, if here I have to fight with someone who is ready to reduce the price of my work for 60% just on the account of the fact that they are ready to live crappy life in order to even get that much, choice is simple - I'll go somewhere where I can get the same or more than that and be respected for the knowledge and experience I am bringing.

The fact of Bolivians, Peruvians and so on coming such huge numbers does not affect Sao Paulo, for example, more or less than hordes of "homemade-bolsa-familia-I-don't-really-wanna-work-when-I-can-get-money-for-free". I hate being politically correct and I believe they would resolve much more issuer if they found the way to eradicate internal migrations, brought only to vote for certain political options... But that would require political will and as long politicians live surrounded with "segurancas" and commute with helicopters, using fore mentioned resources to visit favelas before elections, that will will not exist...

There is plenty examples in Germany, Netherlands and Northern Europe where there were solutions found for repatriation of those that generally did not manage to be come productive part of the society to their respective countries and it worked pretty much well.